Concept: Fausty

Execution: Toggle

Artists wish to go uncredited, but this wouldn’t be the same without their work!

Thanks to our friends and loved ones for putting up with us being shut up in a studio recording, or stuck in meetings writing, or slaving into the wee hours of the morning on a coffee-fueled work binge.


“Inspired,” “Lobby Time,” “Bossa Antigua,” “Airport Lounge.” “Leaving Home,”
Kevin MacLeod (
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

“Variety Show Tv Theme Music,” “We’ll Be Right Back Cut to Commercial Tv Music,” “Variety Show Segment Intro Tv Music,” “Afternoon Talk Show Tv Theme Music,”  
Radio City, from the album “Old Time TV Music”

Many sound effects provided by

Random goofy theme music created using the Ditty App, and brought back because you asked for it!

Wanna contact Fausty on BitMessage? 


1. Disclaimer/Theme

(The Zooier Than Thou podcast contains mature content and language, and may not be appropriate for younger audiences. Thanks for understanding.)

Zooier Than Thou is on! You can join the howl!

2. Intro – Our Best Selves

Fausty: Greetings, beloved zoo nation, and welcome to this optimism-heavy episode of Zooier Than Thou. I’m your co-host and unrepentant old hippie, Fausty.

Toggle: And I’m Mr. Toggle Rat!

Fausty: We’ll be your guide to this episode’s selection of uplifting adventures.

Toggle: Gotta say that, wow, after everything that’s happened in the past month, it does feel good to pivot towards the positive side of things in balance with the harder work we’ve all been doing meanwhile.

Fausty: Indeed it does. Speaking from the seas of zooish podcasts, our collegues at The Zoo Troop certainly ripped us a new one in their sharp but not entirely invalid critique of our last two episodes. They not only took a hard swipe at the methodology with which we approached our animal torture exposé, but also made a rather withering point that my fake voice has not improved over the last couple of episodes. And that’s completely true. I’ve really been working on trying to capture the essence of my normal, everyday, stallion-esque voice. And, well, the truth is that I’ve been so sick lately that it’s hard to really bring the depth of that equine charisma to the fake voice I use on this podcast. So, yes, it’s an embarrassment – I get that. I’d like to make it less, umm, just so not anything amazing on the show here, but even the best technology can’t make my fake voice awesome. I get it, and I’m sorry for it. Hell, backed into a corner I’m just gonna blame cancer and take the easy way out.

Toggle: I’ve been trying, really I have, but any tweaking on my part seems to result in feedback and bruised eardrums. Trust me, if you think he sounds bad now, you don’t want to hear the alternative. We could bring down an airplane with the kind of bizarre radio waves emitted by this voice modulator. So for now, we’ll all have to just deal with Fausty’s shitty fake voice. Listening, try to imagine his mellifluous, commanding, charismatic everyday voice in place of this… this thing we’ve had to use. If we could only let him speak as he normally does – so much better!

Fausty: That aside, and in response to some of the critique we’ve received from other podcasts, we’d like to use this episode to explore the vast terrain of positive, forward-looking, constructive things zoos are doing and to acknowledge the collective embrace of our zoo culture as well all continue exploring the boundaries of what it means to be a zoo in 2019.

Toggle: To that end, let’s start with a really awesome e-mail we received a couple weeks ago from an Anonymouse Businessman. Anonymouse writes: “I’d just like to say a little thanks for saying the things most wont say, especially depending on their position. I run two hardware organizations and one deals with highly advanced military grade weaponry and aircraft and even in the most unlikely profession, zoophiles and zoo-allies still exist there, including me. Love knows no bounds and all I’ve ever wanted is for people to love whoever they want and be happy, but being in such a public position like this has really hindered my ability to do that without risking a lot. Good luck on your endeavors!”

Fausty: I really do want to say, thank you for reaching out to us, Anonymouse, because your letter does remind all our listeners that zoo allies are all around us, in the most unexpected places. One wonderful outcome of launching our little podcast has been the opportunity to touch noses with a much wider, more diverse, more broadly-positioned slice of the zoo universe than we normally see in, for example, the micro-universe of zoo twitter or whatever zoo forum is au courant this month. Like Anonymouse, I have been an entrepreneur early in my life, and I know how bigotry and hate can reach out to damage one’s effectiveness solely on the basis of a zooey sexual orientation. Many of us choose to remain quiet and closeted, knowing the real cost of pushing forward more openly – nobody needs to explain that to me, of all people. Having been through those fires of hell, for years stretching into decades, that cost is more real to me than most anyone else hearing this episode. At the same time, walking those hellish roads, and surviving the experience, has provided me with the somewhat unique privilege of speaking firsthand about life as a zoo, and to a degree about our community and its moral and ethical standards, to a vastly broader audience than would otherwise be possible. As always, I emphasize I’m a spokesman for or leader of no community, lest of all the raucous and inherently unstructured global community of zoos. Rather, I’m just one zoo – with all my own personal goods and bads – engaging with issues all zoos face, and most all zoos discuss amoungst ourselves in less public venues than this podcast. It’s healthy to have some of our otherwise-private world open to a wider public visibility: part of having pride in oneself and one’s community inherently includes a comfort in standing behind that identity and that group participation out in the open, where it counts. Those ashamed of themselves and who they are hide from public view, as a matter of course. Those, like zoos, proud of our positive role in the world and in our personal lives naturally embrace public engagement with who we are whenever possible.

Toggle: There is a sort of perception among many zoos that the best course of action is to lie low, be quiet, and just try not to be noticed. And that makes sense, when you’re trying to escape persecution. The reality of anti-zoo violence and bigotry is something that’s not just swept away with bluster and twitter-courage – unfortunately the real world has real consequences and real hatred that can result in terrible violence and hurt being done to victims of that bigotry. But I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again. Exposure is the solution. Showing people who we actually are instead of letting them make up monster stories is the only true path to acceptance. And let’s be frank: the rest of the world could stand to be reminded that animals aren’t lower beings, that they aren’t subhuman, that treating them with the same basic respect humans give each other should be the norm. That starts with us, as humans who love animals a bit more deeply than the average Joe, and that’s the core tenant of this podcast. It may be a “zooier than thou” cliche to soapbox on the importance of zooish perspectives and zooish embrace of shared life on our planet – but, then again, we’re a Zooier Than Thou podcast so a bit of the ‘ole zooier sermonizing isn’t exactly out of character.

Fausty: Not everyone is in a position to publicly make these sorts of frank, honest declarations, and that’s something we respect here on Zooier Than Thou. We don’t want to be the authoritative zoo voice any topic or issue – that’s not our role, and not an authority we’d ever claim. Instead, what we’re working to do is to help get the ball rolling, just like the hundreds of podcasts that came before us. Our hope is we can inspire a hundred more podcasters to take up the mantle and do it a hundred times better than we do. Sharing life in the zoo society, from the everyday to the more exotic and intense (like we’ve been doing the past few episodes) is healthy for all of us. It reminds us, as zoos, that we’re an inherent and entirely constructive part of the larger human social world. It also helps non-zoos to get a better feel for who we actually are, in real life, simply as zoos being zoos. The truth matters, and reality always wins out in the end. Bizarre efforts to paint zoos as evil, violent, abusive monsters might well get short-term traction by pandering to people’s worst expectations and the desire to find a group to hate. That’s certainly happened in the past 20 years or so. Despite that, the actual objective fact of who we zoos actually are, how we actually live, what actually animates our relationships and our lives as zoos… that reality does inevitably overshadow the horrifying straw-man constructs of anti-zoo bigots. It takes time, and meanwhile so much suffering results from the bigotry those false stereotypes set loose. Far worse, all that energy poured into anti-zoo crusades and into murdering the families of zoos could have been spent actually working to help actual nonhumans be happier, healthier, free from real abuse and real exploitation. Nowhere has that gap of senseless anti-zoo violence and the reality of unaddressed horrific acts of animal torture been more clear than in the recent publication and public exposure of the infamous animal torture leaks we’ve been covering all this past month. Nowhere can we see more clearly the difference between imaginary “abuse” by caring, respectful, compassionate zoos with their partners and the reality of truly horrific, unspeakable, intentional violence and pain inflicted on nonhumans by dysfunctional animal torturers. That it has been zoos leading the charge against these dangerous, manipulative, vicious torturers could not speak more clearly to where zoos stand on the issue of genuine abuse of nonhumans: nobody, truly nobody, is more zealous in pursuing those who hurt nonhumans than zoos are. As zoos, we all know this – the non-zoo world, sadly, often has no idea of how vast that gap is between us and the true abusers. That’s beginning to change, though it’s tragic that what has opened some of those doors is the horrific reality of the torture that zoos have hunted down and exposed.

Toggle: And that’s gonna take one hell of a Zooier Than Thou attitude, but I have to say, that kind of passion and intensity when it comes to pursuing those who target nonhumans for victimization and abuse is a broadly common trait among the zoos I know and love. Stay defiant, Anonymouse, and keep loving with everything you’ve got!

Fausty: We’ve gotten a few more awesome e-mails from the community, but we’re gonna save some of the longer ones for our New Moon episode so we can give them the time and attention they deserve without bloating our core program. So stay tuned! If you haven’t heard your e-mail yet, we haven’t forgotten about you. Also some folks who email do request their comments remain private, and we always respect that. Know, listeners who have shared such emails with us, that your wisdom and contributed knowledge form part of all we do thereafter here at the podcast. If anything, the scaffold on which episodes are built often is those non-public emails that help us see the forest for the trees, and focus on what’s really top of mind in the zoo community right now.

Toggle: Coming up, we’ll be talking to the organizer of Zoophile Pride Day, ZT Horse, and we’ll be exploring ways in which we can open bottlenecks in expressing our best zoo selves. We are, as individuals and as a community, who we choose to be and who our actions show us to be. That means it’s up to us to craft our best selves, and to support those best sides of who we are – to “feed the good wolf” – in every way we can. We see it as a core objective of the podcast, supporting our best zoo selves, and this episodes digs into that and some ways such words become actions and through actions change the world for the better.

Fausty: Stay tuned for more Zooier Than Thou, right after this!


3. Secret Zoo – Blackmail

(Our scene begins with a generic iPhone ringtone, followed by the phone being answered)

John: This is John.

Extortionist: (through phone) John Doolittle?

John: (Unconcerned, but perhaps a little annoyed at having to repeat himself) Yes, this is he.

Extortionist: (With gleeful malice) I know all about you, John. I know your filthy little secret.

John: (Unfazed, possibly going through papers on his desk) Oh yeah?

Extortionist You think this is a joke?

John: I don’t know. I’m not exactly sure what you’re getting at.

Extortionist: Listen up, Johnny-boy, I’ve got proof of your unholy acts in the barnyard. If you don’t want dear ol’ Mom and Dad to get wind of your disgusting habits, you’re gonna have to pay up. You’re officially my bitch now.

John: Ahh, I see. That’s certainly very serious. So just to be clear, you’re saying that if I don’t pay you a certain amount of money, you’re going to tell my parents about my sexuality. Is that right?

Extortionist: You’re damn right.

John: How much is your silence worth?

Extortionist: Ten grand, and not a cent less.

John: Alright, just a moment.

(There’s a small beep, and then John is silent. The extortionist sniffs and clears his throat. A few seconds later, there’s another beep.)

John: Hello, ma?

Mother: Oh, John! It’s so nice you hear from you!

Extortionist: What the hell is this?

Mother: Excuse me?

John: Ma, this gentleman has a ten-thousand dollar secret to tell you.

Mother: What gentleman? Is everything alright, John?

John: Yeah, no worries, Ma. Go ahead, sir.

Extortionist: (At a loss) Wh- uh- well… (clearing his throat) I don’t know how to tell you this, ma’am, but your son is sick.

Mother: Oh, my God. John, what’s wrong?

Extortionist: I have evidence that your son has been involved in illicit activities with a number of animals.

Mother: Illicit activities?

John: He’s trying to say I’ve been in physical relationships with animals, Ma.

Mother: (upset) Jesus Christ, John, are you kidding me? (away from the phone) Greg! (enough pause for a response) Greg, pick up the phone in the living room. (another pause) Just pick up the damn phone.

Greg (Father): (there’s a click as he picks up the line) Hello?

Mother: (pointedly) Talk to your son. He thought it would be funny to call and tell us he has sex with animals.

Father: I beg your pardon?

John: Hi, Pa.

Father: John, did you call to tell your mother you have sex with animals?

John: Something like that. This other gentleman on the line thought you should know.

Father: Someone else is on the line?

Extortionist: I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news, Mr. Doolittle. Your son has a problem and needs help.

Father: You need help? John, you know you can ask me for advice anytime you want. You know, I’ve pleasured a mare or two in my time.

Mom, John, Extortionist: (all at once)

  • Greg!
  • Jesus, Pa, seriously?
  • What the fuck?

Father: You know, I used to spend summers in high school on my uncle’s farm, and one day Dutchess gave me a wink while I was doing chores, and I couldn’t resist.

John: Pa, please stop.

Mother: Greg, there’s another person on the phone.

Extortionist: What the fuck is wrong with you people?

Father: We’re all adults, here. If our son is reaching out to us for advice, we should be able to speak candidly.

John: Pa, I don’t want advice about sex. (shuddering) Christ, I don’t ever want to think about you having sex again.

Extortionist: You’re all fucking sick. (grumbling as he hangs up the line) I can’t fucking believe this.

Father: What the heck was that guy’s problem?
John: He wanted ten-thousand dollars to keep my sex life from you guys.

Mother: He what? What did he think, you were just gonna give him ten thousand dollars?

Father: That’s just ridiculous. You know we love you no matter what, son.

John: I know, Pa. Love you, too.

Mother: I expect a call soon, and no more of this funny business about animals. Keep that to yourself.

John: Of course, Ma. Love ya.

Mother: (while hanging up) The nerve. Some people have no home training.

Narrator: Remember, folks, an extortionist only has as much power over you as you allow them to have. If you ever have to deal with blackmail, keep these important tips in mind.

  • The way you react to the threat will determine the price tag. If you can convince an extortionist that his threat doesn’t worry you, you can tip the odds in your favor. In fact, in many cases, you can neutralize the threat then and there. On the other hand, if you beg and plead, you raise the price of the threat and empower your extortionist.
  • Make sure to be kind to your attacker; insulting them could escalate the situation.
  • If your attacker is being indirect, ask them to clarify. Make them voice the threat fully. Don’t allow them to skirt the issue. If they’re going to be a scumbag, make them own the deed.
  • Never pay an extortionist, or satisfy the terms that are set for their silence. Eventually, they will be back for more, and nine times out of ten they’re going to disclose the harmful information anyway.
  • One of the most radical things you can do is disclose the harmful information yourself. It might seem painful, but consider: who do you want to tell your story? You, or a malicious actor?

Hopefully, you’ll never be in the position to make this difficult decision, but if you are, be prepared to do what you need to do. Above all, don’t let anyone keep you up at night and take advantage of your privacy. You hold the power. Never forget that.


4. Interview with ZT Horse

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 18:49

Welcome back, fellow zoos! We have a very special guest joining us today. I’d like to introduce the founder of Zoo Pride Day and head administrator of the ZooVille forums, ZT Horse.

Say hi, ZT!

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 18:50

Hi, ZT

Z T, 18.05.19 18:50

Hello everyone, glad you and Fausty could have me here.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 18:50

Pleasure to have you!

Z T, 18.05.19 18:50

The pleasure is all on this side of the table….

I heard the “diamond in the rough” podcast online, generally to keep up with the news, and this one stuck out to me. I had to contact you both.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 18:50

We’re honoured that we were able to stand out from the crowd – thank you!

Now, when we approach interviews, we’re looking to better understand our guests and the work they do – sometimes that means we’re going to dig into the loose edges, a bit, as it were: ask some tough questions, look to understand more than just the surface positions. Certainly we mean no disrespect in that, and we hope that the dialogue can be friendly and also incisive.

Z T, 18.05.19 18:51


Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 18:52

Don’t worry, we won’t be -too- hard on you!

Z T, 18.05.19 18:52


Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 18:52

So, there’s a lot of stuff I really want to get to, but I think the best place to start is ZooVille. ZooVille, for our listeners who are unfamiliar, is currently the most high-profile, high-traffic zoophile forum on the web. It’s quickly risen to that position after the much celebrated self-immolation of that despised cancer on the internet, beastforum. Given that short background, how did ZooVille come into being?

Z T, 18.05.19 18:53

In reply to Toggle Rat

Ah, that’s going to be a little long

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 18:53

In reply to Z T

Longer is always better! 😉

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 18:53


Z T, 18.05.19 18:54

Zooville collaboration started the day the announcement BF was going dark. like scattered sheep, a bunch of the good zoophiles, whom come to hate the tyrants that were running BF, Started off-loading the community in to the ark, that is… Telegram, discord, etc etc…

From there We gathered the best technical zoos whom could arrange the setup of a new site. We spent alot of hours late sweating over how to do what BF did, serverside, in as little as 2 months….

I was in the social community team, getting emails, contacts and information before BF went dark…

There was a total of 10 dedicated zoos, whome helped band together to form the needed zoo-power to get a new forum built.

On top of this, we worked in secret, and didnt annouce the site until BF was dead.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 18:57

Were the admins at BF aware this was going on, and if so what was their reaction?

Z T, 18.05.19 18:57

Absolutely not!

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 18:57

In reply to Z T

I would think they’d respond quite negatively if they had been aware – it is just how they tended to act, in general.

Z T, 18.05.19 18:58

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

We couldnt have gotten the good zoos out of there if we didnt work in secret.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 18:59

In reply to Z T

That would be a stressful period, working long hours and always under the risk that BF would get wind and do whatever dumb retaliation they’d think up.

Z T, 18.05.19 18:59

It was tough, but like giving birth, once the labor pain is gone, the new life has a fresh start.

a clean one, fausty

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:00

In reply to Z T

By all appearances, your team succeeded in exactly what you’d hoped to do – you have my congratuations for that as, having built many a forum myself with teams, I know it’s far from a trivial effort.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:01

Alright! Now, I’ve looked into the forum, and we’ve had several people write in about ZooVille, and one of the consistent concerns is the site turning into another BeastForum. Having browsed the forum a bit myself, I can’t say that concern is entirely unfounded. Why do you think that perception exists, and what do you think are the key differences that can give confidence in ZooVile taking a decidedly less destructive, parasitical, unhealthy path than beastforum infamously did?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:01

Great question toggle.

being in the forefront, its inevitable that what i call… Fetishists will come into the scene.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:02

As in, non-zoophiles that are into sex with animals?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:02

Not even that toggle.

These types are a meme. They just want to see a woman banging anything.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:03


Z T, 18.05.19 19:03

Fetishes. Lurkers.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:03

In reply to Z T

The degradation obsessives, yes?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:03

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

Indeed fausty.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:05

In reply to Z T

That is the market BFI has always targeted – Hans, the unsettling Dutchman who owns all those related “animal porn” companies, absolutely found a template of “woman being degraded by interaction with ‘animal’ and pumped out many such films. There is apparently a market of non-zoos who are attracted to that. It’s a problem for zoos, as they do tend to have an outsized impact in some areas of overlap.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:05

But with the open nature of the site, these types will arrive,

What we’ve tried to do very differently from BF, is we’ve set rules to curb abusive content, and excessive fetishistic content…

We’ve kept the site free of scat, and other extremes.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:05

In reply to Z T

I don’t know what you have against Ella Fitzgerald

Z T, 18.05.19 19:05

In reply to Toggle Rat

Laughs hard

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:05

In reply to Toggle Rat

sighs deeply

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:06

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

Oh, don’t you give me that, you dog mongler

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:06

They keep it to straight jazz, none of that weirdo avant garde stuff!

Z T, 18.05.19 19:06

In reply to Toggle Rat

We didn’t care for the fact that she was a huge BeastForum VIP scat member.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:06

In reply to Z T

Tons of audio file uploads, just pure bloody scat!

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:06


It really didn’t mean a thing, did it?

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:07

Unless it’s got that swing, nope.

Skadda de dadda de badda badda booo….

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:07

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

I’ve waited my whole life to hear you try to scat.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:07

Hahahaha – cornered!

Z T, 18.05.19 19:07

But back to the fetishists…

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:07

Yes, back to legit issues..

Z T, 18.05.19 19:08

mixed in that crowd, there are some curious about bestiality, some who want to try it, some who want their questions answered… and that was the real meat of the good parts of BF. It was the information given by the good zoos.

To support this, we’ve created the articles and blog sections…

Which is non-pornographic, dedicated and front page to the serious zoo discussion

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:09

In reply to Z T

Excellent – we have some questions targeting that coming up.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:09

the zooville mod team feels the information and conversation about zoo should be open to all.

This means we have to take the good, the bad and the ugly

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:11

I have a follow-on question that is long and, even for me, pretty aggressive. Are you comfortable with me dropping it into the interview? It is really my last and central bf-related question and I’d prefer to just get through it so we can move on.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:11


DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:12

So, with regards to becoming just another facsimile of BeastForum, what do you think sets you apart from BeastForum? I know we’re sort of hitting this issue hard, but this is the core question not only of the two of us personally, but of absolutely every listener who has written in and brought up this topic. Most everyone in the community seems intensely motivated not only to find non-beastforum opportunities to congregate and collaborate, but more than that to actively nip in the bud anything that seems to be steering down that dark path. We’ve all felt the burn from beastforum turning itself into a self-appointed lynchpin of interspecies internet dialogue, and I don’t think there’s any willingness to simply sit back and “hope for the best” if it seems like a forum is starting down that road. We’ve all learned a hard lesson from beastforum’s ugly path through the past 20 years of online life, and many of us aren’t just sitting back to allow another beastforum – or something worse – to get a head of steam whilst we do nothing. So as confrontational as this seems, what can you do to really lessen the concerns of the community on that question. Specifically, having received a temporary domain redirect from for a considerable period of time, can you say that ZooVille is truly and fully separate and distinct from beastforum and everyone involved as administrators with that blight on our world?

It is not intended to be disrespectful, but rather to clear the air for listeners so it’s addressed face-first and put to rest thereafter, I hope.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:12

I will be glad to answer that.

First off, if there something that corrupts, its money. Money is power. and absolute power corrupts absolutely. correct fausty?

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:14

In reply to Z T

I would absolutely not disagree with this statement, based on my own experiences. BF’s entanglement with for-profit animal porn ventures seems to have set a rot right at the centre of the whole thing.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:14

Agreed. BF was very secretive about its funding.

None of the mod team were ever associated with BF administration nor were they voluenteers in anyway with BF moderation…

I would set as the polar opposite a funding model like that employed by bluelight successfully for decades: a nonprofit, with an elected Board, and with tangible funding goals and transparent public reporting of funds and use of funds.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:16

In reply to Z T

This is very good to know.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:16

The first thing we decided to do, was make our funding transparent. We’ve disclosed all operating costs, the mod team is all voluneteer, and we’ve posted our public BTC address in which anyone with a block explorer can audit zoovilles funds.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:17

In reply to Z T

So in laymen’s terms for rats who don’t know what the fuck that means, basically, anyone who wants to can see where the money’s coming from and going to

Z T, 18.05.19 19:17

In reply to Toggle Rat

Yes toggle. Its 100% auditable

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:17

In reply to Z T

Does the site currently self-fund from inbound donations, or are there separate funding sources?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:18

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

The mod team self funded the initial startup phase and currently still is funding it. The donation’s at this time amount to about 600$.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:18

With regards to the redirect, how did that come to pass and what can you say to lessen concerns of our listeners that it implies a much closer connection between ZV and BF than would be otherwise acknowledged?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:20

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

We do not know. There were several competing forums after BF’s death, we are not alone. However with my social team, we also reached out to other forum creators to see if it was more viable to make our own forum or direct the zoos to an already made site.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:21

In reply to Z T

Are there plans to create “tiered access” that requires payment from members to access certain sections or materials?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:21

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

Absolutely Not.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:21

In reply to Z T

If it was within your control, and you could go back in time, would you want to have that redirect occur or would you have preferred that it did not happen?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:22

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

It makes no difference to me. All the zoos we cared about joined zooville because it was managed by zoos whom they knew and trusted. A team they also knew in real life for some.

Anyone else who wanted to join us, is just extra.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:22

In reply to Z T

Fair enough. I believe the next question is Toggle’s…

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:23

Alright, I have just one more question along these lines, and I want to ask it because everyone who’s contacted us and mentioned ZooVille have, without fail, mentioned this concern.

What do you think you guys at the site can do to address the concerns people have and prevent yourselves from falling into the same dark pitfalls that BeastForum found themselves in. I mean, in specific terms, are there things that your admin team is doing and has done to prevent even a drift in that direction, whether it would be intentional or not? Are there things about the beastforum lesson that directly motivate how you run the site, and what you know from that lesson in terms of how things can go wrong if not run effectively and with positive community engagement?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:24


After handling the funding portion…

We seperated our “power” in a sense by linking to other large forums and zoo sites.

Forumzoone is a german zoo forum with 10K members

Not affiliated with us in anyway, but they have an english section.

Equibooru is a booru site run by a very good zoo, based out of russia.

Also we had also share links…

So we also gave users a way out of ZV ever became tyrannical

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:26

If a member chooses to leave ZV or even is banned, are they able to remove or delete their content from the site afterwards?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:27

yes absolutely!

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:27

Ahh yes, that’s a big difference from beastforum and it’s affiliated sites

Z T, 18.05.19 19:27

We understand that the users content is their IP. They have the right to do what they will with it.

We give them so much freedom, they can choose to add crypto address to their works.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:28

In reply to Z T

That feels to me to be an important checkpoint against the sort of abusive things BF so often did with the content of members, often after they had left and cut all ties with the site.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:29

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

Now, for our listeners at home, I have to say that I brought a concern to staff over a post I saw in which someone passingly made reference to doing sexual activity that was clearly abusive, and they responded swiftly with disciplinary action. This is a step in the right direction, and definitely not a stance BeastForum made in the past.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:29

In reply to Toggle Rat

Yes our report button works!

and believe me, our mod team keeps the shit off of zoovilles streets.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:29

Although I haven’t had time to dive into the forum side of things like Toggle did – this is no decision on my part to set a low priority on that task, but rather really does reflect my health limits including a recent five-day stay in hospital due to cancer side effects. Despite that, I did take the chance to spend time here and there in the private telegram chat for ZooVille members. Overall, I really have enjoyed that venue and it’s been fun to watch discussions wax and wane – from time to time someone brings up something in which I’m a front-line participant, always a somewhat uncomfortable or awkward experience, but in this case when I’ve stepped in and clarified my role, discussions have been engaged and vibrant – overall healthy at a baseline level. Insofar as that chat reflects the evolving ethos and culture of ZooVille itself, it makes me feel optimistic about the overall tone of dialogue and manner in which the channel is managed and overseen. Do you think the chat is a good reflection of ZooVille more broadly, and if so what do you think is the key to building that kind of constructive, meaningful dialogue amoungst zoos?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:30

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

The chat is managed by Doglover101 on ZooVille. Im not actively involved deeply with that section. However, it was very carefully considered, and we chose a platform that allows encryption to protect our users.

But id like to add that zooville is a very free speech arena. Users have and did rail on the mod team publically, and we did not ban.

Instead we debated and conversed our critics.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:33

In reply to Z T

That’s certainly vastly different from BF!

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:33

Just to jump in, here, we actually mean the telegram chat :3

Z T, 18.05.19 19:33

In reply to Toggle Rat

Oh our wonderful little telegram chat.

Toggle, that chat is a relic of the initial gathering of the exodus from beastforum

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:34

In reply to Z T

A happy relic, indeed.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:34

its closed off now, and i kept it. Its a nice little space to kick up my hooves after a long day at ZooVille

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:36

In reply to Z T

I gotta say, I really like that space. That’s the kind of microcosm I’d want to exist in a zoo community.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:37

In reply to Toggle Rat

yes toggle and ZV has an arrangement for that…

Z T, 18.05.19 19:37

The groups tab, we allow groups of zoos to find their safe spaces. We understand being zoo is complex. Questions of politics, religion, and morality come up, and these discussions need safe spaces.

As you recall, such topics were banned on BF

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:38

Of all things to be banned

Please, post your chicken fucking video in 12 20 megabyte chunks, but refrain from talking about Buddhism.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:39

In reply to Z T

I lost track of the banspace on BF – it seemed arbitrary and entirely at the whim of whatever admin was in charge at the time, tbh.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:39

Those deep, i would even say spiritual discussions, just couldnt happen on BF.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:40

In reply to Z T

Those discussions did not generate revenue for Beaker and his co-owners of the porn side of things.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:40

We want that sort of discussion for the zoo community

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:40

In reply to Z T

I think there really is a spiritual center to our community that certainly gets neglected in a space like BeastForum

Z T, 18.05.19 19:41

In reply to Toggle Rat

Those conversations have to happen toggle. BF set us back 20 years on that important self actualization.

If we cannot come to grip and moral terms with ourselves, we are divided.

Divided we fall.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:42

In reply to Toggle Rat

BF served to strip almost all of the positive sides of the zoo experience from the discussion there, and left behind far too often the negative and damaged side of things – which, as we saw in situations like that of Kero, could and did result in horrible outcomes that left damage behind for years and years afterwards.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:42


DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:43

In reply to Toggle Rat

The tone and cultural energy of a forum absolutely starts with the leadership team, and without that they devolve into cesspools of drama and destructive intent.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:43

I don’t want to think about what happened to Kero. Let’s keep this positive.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:43

keep the kero to zero ok.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:43

In reply to Z T

You could write for the podcast with lines like that

Now, going back to something from before, I noticed that you place a lot of emphasis on the blogging and articles sections of the site. I’ve noticed you post articles quite frequently yourself. Why do you feel that these sections are so important?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:43

In reply to Toggle Rat

Emphasis on reach out to academics, researches, philosophers, and anyone from a non-zoo perspective.

These people are the ones we have to reach to get anywhere with our cause and strife.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:45

So these articles are somewhere where researchers can get a glimpse into our world?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:45

Articles, yes. It is all non-zoo written publications, studies, documentaries and information that gives a non-zoo an alternative perspective of our lifestyle, in hopes that they can change their prejudices they hold

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:47

There is a new generation of legitimate researchers (unlike Sendler, the fraud) who are taking a fresh look at us, more in line with Dr. Miletski’s work and more aware of the existence of false stereotypes that have no foundation in our social reality.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:49

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

That is key, but also, and i would say more importantly, is the philosophical defenders of zoo that write in our defense.

Winning minds, changes hearts.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:50

In reply to Z T

These remain fairly thin on the ground thus far, yes?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:50

They are growing in number, if you recall things like dearest pet.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:50

In reply to Z T

Yes, Dekkers opened many doors.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:51

We need more of that.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:52

I of course see an important role for journalistic coverage of zoo issues that is fact-based and objective – my own dedication to that kind of work likely biases my view of how important it is.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:52

Thats why articles on ZV exist, it is a special place for that.

Now Blogs…

Is an offshoot of articles, being written by zoos and for reaching that same academic audience

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:55

In reply to Z T

So we have articles for that objective perspective, and blogs for that personal perspective

I think that’s an important mix. Because you can’t really understand us without listening to us.

Z T, 18.05.19 19:56

Oh i wanted to point out one last thing…

Blogs are taken so seriously, a single inappropriate blog post or creation is awarded with infractions or a temporary 10 day ban for the user to meditate on the seriousness of that section.

It is NOT for porn.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:56

That sounds like a place where good things have the opportunity to happen – it’s not something I’ve seen as a focus in prior zoo forums, to be honest.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:57

You had another question about the articles section, Doug?

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 19:57

I think I’ve covered my questions regarding the blog section, to be honest.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 19:58

Alright, then, I think we’ve spent plenty of time talking about the forum. Let’s jump to the topic I’m really excited to cover. Can you tell us how Zoo Pride Day came into being?

Z T, 18.05.19 19:58

Ah zoo pride…

a fathom of a idea in the mind of zoos everywhere…

an idea lost without a home…

But it hit not just me, because i will admit, it wasnt my idea.

A very close zoo friend told me in our chat that he wished he could have a day where he can celebrate his self acceptence

Where not just him, but all zoos, can put aside their differences and celebrate the love our animal mates give us.

I was moved.

I felt my heart warm and smile at the idea.

because it’s a beautiful thing.

Thats where it started, it was homegrown.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:01

I love that

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:01

In your vision over time, how do you see Zoo Pride Day evolving into part of an overall community focus on positivity and constructive engagement overall? Where do you think it goes as more folks see it and choose to actively support it? Finally, how do you see that interacting with the larger social melee surrounding anti-zoo bigotry, cross-species activism, and efforts to move beyond hate-based caricatures of the zoo community in the larger social world?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:02

Fausty how hard is it to kill an idea?

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:03

I had an idea for a game of thrones skit called game of bones, but Fausty shot it down, and that was the death of a terrible idea

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:04

In reply to Toggle Rat

Not even an “idea,” that one – more of a bad joke manifesting as a thinly-laid concept! 😉

But really, this is a complex question – ideas can be killed, though mostly by killing everyone who carries them, which we hope is not the case in regards to any sort of formal zoo genocide.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:04

haha, but even then, history shows, the written idea is still immortal.

Ideas are what id say is closest to immortality we can ever get.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:04

In reply to Z T

Absolutely true. Even with censorship of the printed word, samizdat has proved to be profoundly resilient when activists and dissidents have the courage to retain their conviction and to share with others.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:04

that’s where this idea molded not into a pride event, not an event, fausty…

A holiday.

Its a holiday. A Celebration of an idea.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:05

In reply to Z T

The holiday idea is interesting, and has semantic power beyond the typical “event” concept.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:05

A holiday, where zoos in their own privacy, can join together in thanking our animal mates and the love they have given us.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:06

In reply to Z T

Do you see a public face to this, in some instances, or purely a private holiday?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:06

Think about this historically… even religiouslly…

There have been holidays held in private by persecuted people because open celebration was death

But these people, they clinged to that idea.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:07

In reply to Z T

Absolutely true: Jewish community, Roma, Early Christian communities, frankly.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:07

When the time came, when the old powers died off, these holidays became public

That is the binding union that is missing for zoos.

To put down the spear of country, politics and religion.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:10

In reply to Z T

In seeing this more in spiritual terms (which I, fwiw, have always found both compelling and naturally a part of my own orientation), it definitively sets it apart from the LGBT historiography in which rights and community improvement have always been framed in purely secular, legalistic terms. This charts a divergent course forward for zoos, one as you say more aligned with historically persecuted groups cohering around religious community than anything else.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:10

It’s a very deep love, it hurts me to my core there is divisions among us.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:11

In reply to Z T

Well every community has divisions and a degree of discord – I’d argue that is part of any healthy culture, although it can become extreme and tear that same culture apart.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:11

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

We should be united, in spirit, in the idea and love for our animals.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:12

For me the bright line in terms of zoo-on-zoo conflict has always been the use of outing and the overt efforts to destroy “opponents” within the zoo community by exposing them to attack from bigoted non-zoos. That is never healthy and when it happens it corrodes any sense of cohesive zoo community in a way that is nearly fatal and very difficult to heal.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:12

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

Ugh, that’s such garbage. I can’t stand that it’s ever come down to that sort of heinous shit.

But I have to say, ZT, That’s one hell of a concept, all together!

Kind of makes my original next question moot. But I’ll reframe it: so, on the forum page for the event, there’s some small forum-related events happening. How can people who aren’t affiliated with the forum participate?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:12

In reply to Toggle Rat

anyone can participate! zoos and non-zoos alike…

There is an art contest and a logo change contest like google does…

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:12

In reply to Z T

That’s a great concept, I think.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:13

On pride day and week, the logo will be changed to a community artist who wins the contest.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:13

In reply to Z T

Naturally the activist in me wants to see t-shirts, ball caps, pins, etc.

I myself wear a “zeta” lapel pin to many formal occasions – it is a small thing, likely rarely noticed, but it carries for me a sense of pride in myself and our community that is tangible and overt.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:13


Make america zoo again merch is a work in progess


Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:14


The old days of zoo America

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:15

In reply to Z T

That’s absolutely a line I played with over the winter – blue caps with that logo on them!

Z T, 18.05.19 20:15

In reply to Toggle Rat

Well id like to see the days where it was just a laughable offense and nothing more.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:15

Right, I can understand that.

I’m looking toward the future where it’s not even offensive, myself :3

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:16

In reply to Z T

I hope you’ll keep an eye on evolving efforts lead by zoos to root out truly evil activities that victimize nonhumans – I personally believe that such work is both vitally important standalone, and does also clearly demarcate to non-zoo audiences who we are as a community, what matters to us, and how we choose to engage with those who do truly bad things to nonhuman individuals.

It is to me a profound opportunity both to do right, and in bluntly political terms to be seen to be doing right in a way that resonates with anyone who cares about nonhumans.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:17

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

I have some comments to make to the non-zoo listeners on this subject

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:17

In reply to Z T

Please do!

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:17

In reply to Z T

By all means

Z T, 18.05.19 20:17

To those listening, who are non-zoos…

Remember that predators like crowds to hide their evil intentions…

With anti-bestiality laws in place, you are not aiding the zoo community to report the blatant sadists who like to hide in our crowd…

These people are evil, we hate them just as you do, but they entangle themselves, lie, cheat and blackmail good zoos to not speak up…

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:19

In reply to Z T

Yes, this has happened a lot

Z T, 18.05.19 20:19

by keep these archaic laws in place, you protect sadists.

Those zoos wont report in afraid of their own persectution.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:20

In reply to Z T

This is absolutely a side effect of anti-zoo laws and has resulted in many such situations going unreported for far too long.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:20

And not for a lack of moral obligation, certainly, as we’ve seen this past month

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:21

In reply to Toggle Rat

No. In fact we’ve seen many zoos come forward despite real concerns for their own safety – and the safety of their loved ones – because they simply could not continue to look the other way.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:21

They have fears, they dont want to be doxxed out of persecution.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:22

In reply to Z T

And it’s not personal fears. People don’t understand what happens to the animals zoos love when they’re persecuted

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:22

In reply to Z T

This is accurate, and – after filtering out the sadists simply trying to sow confusion and prevent their own exposure – there are many zoos who legitimately fear that ANY exposure of sadists will immediately morph into an anti-zoo jihad that merely targets healthy zoos and leaves sadists untouched. This has indeed happened before, and it is not an empty concern – not at all.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:23

That’s in fact exactly what happened last time, in September.

And the architects of those leaks actively knew they were making that happen. But that’s another story for last month.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:23

I understand many attacked you fausty for the leaks, many whom were zoo…

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:23

In reply to Z T

Fausty has been a real asshole on twitter, to be fair 😛

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:23

In reply to Z T

Many of the attacks that have taken place, from legitimate zoos, are absolutely reflections of deep fear on their part and as such I am far more empathetic with the causes of that fear than I take those attacks at all personally.

We are limited in what we can say right now, regarding the publication of the leaks and the current status of that.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:24

What needs to been seen and understood, is that these anti zoo laws protect sadists.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:24

In reply to Z T

This is something that is being addressed in how this leak and the heavy response forthcoming is playing out. I cannot speak to details at this point, for good reasons which I support. I can say that there is an opportunity here to turn over an entirely new page in the book of how good people who do care about nonhumans, but whom are absolutely non-zoos, view zoos and our relation to genuine abuse of nonhumans.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:24

I dont even like calling them zoo-sadists, because they are NOT zoo.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:24

That’s a fact.

They are torturers.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:25

I’ve had a zoo pm me and told me he was in tears seeing those leaks.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:26

They’re fucking god awful

Z T, 18.05.19 20:26

I tried to comb through them, but i couldnt do it. It’s like battery acid on my heart.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:26

In reply to Z T

I am not ashamed to say that I have spent hours simply sitting on the sofa and crying, as a result of working on these leaks. Just sobbing, moaning. They are so horrific, they scar anyone who does dig into them.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:26

That shit will ruin you.

I’m rarely not thinking about those leaks

I’ll have trouble sleeping sometimes

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:27

Now, the good news is that this issue has moved on to vastly larger spaces and vastly more highly-resourced activists working on this with us at this point. And that’s the most I can say for now on that.

Getting to that place, as Toggle knows, involved me breaking down in a certain phone call and I think that breakdown opened the door to a kind of zoo/non-zoo cooperation on this that is unprecedented and that I hope opens the door to many such efforts together in the future.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:27

Alright, seriously, I don’t want to think about this right now. Let’s get back to zoo pride day.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:29

Yes, back to Zoo Pride (though for me we, as zoos, have so much to be proud of in our exposure of these horrors thus far – this is part of being the best of ourselves, to do that hard work and do it as a community despite the scars and fears we all bring to such things)

But a lighter note: Is there a reason you chose July 1st for your holiday?

I’m assuming it’s not to overlap with Canada Day… although maybe I should just let you set out your choice rather than me putting my expectations foremost in the discussion?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:29

July 1st was chosen as there is a few normal animal holidays on that week


Our lovely animal mates tend to be in their… ahem… warmer periods.

wink wink

nudge nudge

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:30


Lord help this sinner

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:31

Summer, in the Northern Hemisphere, is indeed a time when all of us mammals tend to be more at ease and relaxed as we appreciate the good weather and sunshine.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:31

Nothing wrong in celebrating with some consentual interspecies loving. 😉

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:31

In reply to Z T

Fair enough!

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:31

Let me ask you a more personal question: to you and in your own framing, what does it mean to be a zoophile?

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:31

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

You bitch you stole my question.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:32

In reply to Toggle Rat

That’s actually true – though I’m not really a bitch, more of a pushy stallion 😉

Z T, 18.05.19 20:32

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

You treat your animals as your own body.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:33

In reply to Z T

So lots of fast food and soft drinks, right?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:33

In reply to Toggle Rat

laughs you did ask how I view being a zoo, which would be sans the trans fat.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:33


DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:33

Whole grains, lots of veggies…

Z T, 18.05.19 20:33

You cherish, care, and love your body. Or your supposed to anyway…

You should love your animal mate the same way.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:33

What kinds of things do you do you think it’s important for zoophiles to do so that we can always be our best selves, as zoos?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:34

Self acceptance. Reflection on how that changes your entire life goals.


Talk to most zoos, their dreams…

They are the salt of the earth usually…

a peaceful life on a slice of land, a little home with their mates.

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:35

In reply to Z T

So very true.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:35

Thats all they’d ever want.

Live their days out in peace

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:35

So my dream of being a country music singer is misguided after all, is what you’re saying?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:36

Not with that voice toggle

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:36

Haha fuck you

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:36

In reply to Toggle Rat

Less of a dream than a… weird surreal fantasy?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:36

Maybe a female 2nd string singer

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:36

What does that even mean?

Z T, 18.05.19 20:36

Like the backup of the backup of beyonce

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:36


DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:36

In reply to Toggle Rat

A post-postmodern zooish country scene might just work in today’s world – who the fuck knows?

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:37

In reply to DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink

I don’t think it’s off brand to really, really love your horse

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:37

In reply to Toggle Rat

Lots of zoodar hits in some of the old country classics tbh.

Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:37


DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:38

ZT, thanks so much for taking the time to speak with us today. Listeners, if you’re so inclined, feel free to take a look at, check out the articles, and join us in celebrating Zoo Pride Day on July 1st.

Z T, 18.05.19 20:38

Thank you for having me on the show!

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:38

(I’m still processing the “backup of the backup of beyonce” concept – it’s deep!)

Z T, 18.05.19 20:38


Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:39

In reply to Z T

Thanks for coming! It’s been a pleasure!

DB ‘fausty’ LeConte-Spink, 18.05.19 20:39

Thanks for being here, ZT, and congrats on the new forum – may it come to be all your hope, and more!

Z T, 18.05.19 20:39


Toggle Rat, 18.05.19 20:40

Still more Zooier Than Thou coming up! Stay tuned!


5. Ask Zooey

Zooey: Welcome back to Ask Zooey, the authoritative program for mutually respectful cross-species relationship advice. I’m your most famously fabulous host Zooey!

Toggle: And I’m just a do-good rat who got lost in the studio lot one day and got pulled in to co-host this show!

Zooey: We’re charged up and ready to answer those burning questions from our listeners at home! And from the heart, friends just don’t even hesitate to drop us a line through our twitter account, @askzooey (that’s Z-O-O-E-Y), through the @ZooierThanThou twitter, or using the all-too-apt anonymous submission form at with the subject “Ask Zooey!” Submission can be a kind of freedom, and your submissions will jump right into the work that Zooey does. Don’t be shy, we don’t bite…

Toggle: Lately we’ve gotten a nice steady uptick in meaty submissions from our four-legged friends, but we sure could stand to hear from more human listeners. The two-leggers seem a lot less comfortable with putting love life questions up for team solutions. No need to be shy, folks: four legs or two, we’ll always sniff out a way for everyone to find that healthy place to be close with loved ones!

Zooey: Today, we’ll start with a letter from Bitchy and Befuddled in Brisbane. Bitchy writes, “Dear Zooey: my human friend and I just started getting serious. We’ve been mostly just dating except for maybe a few days every six months for a few years. He’s been just really a wonderful gentleman all that time, kind and gentle, playful and handsome. To me he’s really a genuine stud, even if he’s not a dog. And when I decided to share myself with him, he’s never put a paw, or foot, down wrong with me. We plan out my times a long way out. He takes “vacation” at work, oh but he’s not on vacation with me! I showed him how to put his tongue to good use, and he’s just been the fastest and most passionate learner in that department, let me tell you. He’s a treasure, really he is. And when he’s under me, pleasuring me, tasting me… that’s a stud, just a different kind of stud than the normal ones. I say it’s not only about a gorgeous coat and dense ruff – he fills in with creativity in passion for all that stuff that he’s just not got.

But now that I’ve gone ahead and promoted him from just an unusually-eager and orally talented romantic suitor, to inside-tie-provider, I’m starting to realize, if we’re being honest here, he’s just not as well-endowed as I’d hoped. And it’s not just the short and skinny side of things, but it’s… I’m not sure how to say this gently, it’s that he doesn’t have a knot. And honey, I’m not trying to say that he’s stuck with some “GSD knot” that’s not so much knot, not at all. It’s that… there’s nothing there, girl. No-thing: just a shaft and then… the danglers, and nothing in between. Even the most nothing-to-inflate GSD boy is looking like the Goodyear Blimp compared to my “shaft-y” bald lover boy.

Step-over or step-aside? We’re not asking those questions here; there’s nothing for that poor gentleman to step over, and bless his heart but he sure does do his best to go through all the other motions. In the thrust-and-push department he’s right up there in Rottie territory – that part, he’s a stud’s stud and nothing to say but top marks, from this girl – but he’s never going to give a girl the tie she needs. And she sure does need those deep, throbbing, move-those-guts-around-new-man-in-town, stretch your world until it’s all stars and happy barks kinds of ties – the ones that leave you pulled-around and panting and sore but in a sore-so-you-want-to-howl-the-joy-of-the-tie kind of sore… a girl needs that, and when she needs that, and he can’t deliver? Should I fake satisfaction, and if I do won’t he know just from the physics of it all that I’m not fully-fulfilled? Am I setting us up for failure since he’ll always know I’m dreaming of him with everything he’s missing, and imagining what it would be like with us if his balloon wasn’t stuck in thin-banana mode? Is the truth what we need between us, or is this one of those times where too much truth breaks the tie, as it were? I love him for everything he is, and there’s so much more to a stud than a baseball knot and 30 minutes of can-barely-breathe big-boy inflation. I know that and it’s really true. Still… does that mean this passionate girl won’t ever get to feel that full-body satisfaction after a guts-deep tie?”

Toggle: Wow, what a passionate letter, Bitchy and Befuddled. Rest assured, you’re not the only bitch who’s written in with woes about their inevitably less-endowed two-legged lovers.

Zooey: But Bitchy, you touch on something very important with your question. Should you fake it? And the answer is a loud, resounding, “absolutely (k)not!” Honesty is so important in relationships, and expressing your dissatisfaction is the only way to resolve your issues and avoid creating bitterness and resentment in your relationship. It’s not easy, honey, and it’s gonna be awkward no matter how you ease him into the talk. But you love him, and girl I can see his love for you in every sentence you write about that dear boy. You work past that awkward part, because you’ve got a stud worth keeping in your personal at-home family pack.

Toggle: Luckily, Bitchy, there are solutions to your problem! Intimate aids of all shapes and sizes are plentiful and right on point for the craving you feel. There’s even plenty of variously-sized canine-style wearables that you can take a look at and see if they’ll fit your own needs. Some come with the knot fully engorged, and serve to add extra thickness and length to the entire shaft. Others have inflatable knots for a more natural tying experience. While you’re experiencing the bliss of the knot, your paramour is stimulated by the inside of the toy. Still others provide a knot for the base of his shaft while leaving his head exposed for normal penetration, a sort of “best of both worlds” approach. In all cases, it’s important for your human to purchase special lubricant for these occasions, as unlike regular canine cocks, these silicone supplements aren’t slick from the start. Don’t skimp on the lube! Mostly you’ll want thick and silicon-based for this kind of mutual pleasure: it’s the difference between a sore ending for both of you, and hours of escalating fun that leave you two lovers exhausted with pleasure.

Zooey: However, and this is important, toys aren’t the solution for every couple, and sometimes lube and toys just don’t work well with your bodies and how you engage with each other. Don’t force the idea just because it’s the “in” thing to do nowadays: Dragons may or may not be Bad, but that doesn’t mean your lady-parts feel that rubbery monster push into the mix and react like it’s a big, baseball-knotted heavy-breathing stud! Keep an open mind, but let your body tell you what works and what just doesn’t do the job. No shame in giving something a try and the two of you decide it’s just not doing the job, honey, none at all. Let the youtube young guns wow the world with their exotic appendage adventures – for us world-travelled girls, sometimes bright green and flaccid just isn’t gonna make us sit up and howl with delight. No shame in loving the real thing, girl!

Toggle: Above all, honesty and communication are key. If you’re faking it, he can’t work on refining and upgrading his performance for you. Without your honest feedback, even when it’s not all yips of orgasmic joy, he just can’t fully pleasure you the way you deserve to be pleasured. That, my passionate friend, can only lead to dissatisfaction and in the end it can’t but erode your relationship despite all you two have going for you. You’ll find that path to contentment and mutual honesty – no question from us on that! It may take some work, and some honest talk about the facts of nature when it comes to two-legged boys: they simply don’t have the tools that the furry gentlemen take for granted, and nothing you say will change that. No excuse for dishonesty, dear lady – that’s a challenge and I know you can rise to it and be stronger as a couple for the hard work you put in to finding that path forward, together and as a team.

Zooey: Thanks so much for your heartfelt inquiry, Bitchy. We’re nothing but confident in you two taking your pleasure to new heights, new levels of beauty. Don’t ever doubt him, or yourself, or the two of you as a mated pair. Stick with it, you’ll never be sorry for taking the honest way forward. We’re just telling you what I know you already know, girl – just confirming that truth in your heart. Go with that, never look back!

Toggle: Our next letter is from Smitten in SoCal. Smitten writes: “Dear Zooey, For the longest time, I was going stir crazy. It can be lonely being a show girl, working for fish, spending your days swimming in circles. But a few months ago, I met this great guy, one of the trainers here, and we hit it right off immediately. I’ve been hinting for months that I wanted to pursue something deeper than your typical trainer-dolphin relationship, but he’s a little thick, or maybe just reluctant. He finally got the message a couple of weeks ago, but time alone can be hard to come by. That’s not really the issue, though. It’s the logistics of intimacy. I’ve always thought being suspended together deep under the water was super romantic, but I’m sensing he’s not really into that idea. And then there’s the matter of his skin-tight swimsuit that keeps his manly endowment pinned tightly to his belly. What’s a girl to do? Don’t they make those with holes or something? We click on so many levels, but I can’t seem to communicate these basic desires in a way that breaks through to him on a… really on a personal level. I know he has strong feelings for me. And I also know that he’s a gentleman, and in being so attentive to my boundaries and right to choose whether physical intimacy is right for me, I actually think he’s just ended up making himself unable to react to what we’re both feeling in a natural and comfortable way. I love him for his caring and caution – that’s really part of what makes him such a wonderful guy. But, it’s also making it so hard for us to let things evolve the way we both know they should. It’s not in my nature to force the issue, or push him too hard and maybe make him feel I’m not respecting his wishes – of course that’s not me! But does that mean that we’ll never get the chance to just be two people enjoying our opportunity to share more than just friendship? I simply won’t let this opportunity slide past my fins without doing everything I can to let our closeness grow into what it wants to be! What should I do?”

Zooey: Well, Smitten, it may be possible that your paramour is reading you loud and clear, but there are certain limitations that prevent him from being able to fully fulfill your desires. One thing immediately comes to mind that you may not have given thought to, one that’s sort of obvious in hindsight, but even for an intellect like yours, just might not have really risen to the top of your mind. Though they’re also mammals, humans can’t hold their breath underwater the same way dolphins can. He probably does his best to cover for this limitation, and you might not have really noticed just how crippling that limitation is. It’s like his ability to see. He can’t see like you. He’s always seeing strange, inaccurate half-snapshots of pieces of the world. I know he covers for this handicap pretty well, and because of your caring for him you likely really don’t grasp just how crippled he is when it comes to vision and spatial awareness – but that might also be part of his hesitancy to really be intimate with you. Moving in free space underwater is, for him, a hall of mirrors – hardly helpful when it comes to comfortable intimacy, for anyone! And the same goes for the simple ability to retain breath underwater – a minute or two for him is going to be baseline, maybe a bit more, but not if he’s active, and love is an active pastime. Again, he’s worked hard to overcome those limits of his, to present a less crippled picture to you – he cares for you and of course he doesn’t want to seem weak and limited in your presence. What’s also natural is that, in caring for him, you really don’t dwell on those limits – that’s a beautiful thing, for both of you, but it’s putting some unintended blocks in the way of your connection. But, honey, that’s not a concrete wall too high to jump! Really it could be as simple as working with him in a shallower play space, giving him less intimidation from a complex environment as he eases into a closer physical space with you. And, you can help work around his human limits by making unnaturally-frequent surfacings seem like a natural act for you. Don’t force him to ask you to break off because he can’t manage his breath like a normal marine mammal! Guide him up, let him refill his limited lungs, and in time I think he’ll feel at ease enough to forget his handicaps – even if just for a short while – and partake in a physical love with you that’s not held back by his shortcomings. I know you can do it!

Toggle: We’re not experts in marine- to land-mammal cross species interaction, so we reached out to a dear friend of the show who is also a dolphin lover. Our expert suggested floating perpendicular to your human partner while he stands upright in shallow water. Or, for a more intimate position, floating on your back whilst he straddles you, still standing upright – this may provide more leverage for the pair of you to enjoy one another. And if we can take a page from Bitchy’s book above, never doubt the power of a human’s penchant for oral sex. Penetration isn’t everything, and I guarantee your two-legged lover will get as much out of your enjoyment of his tongue as you get out of him. It’s not conventional dolphin sex, and if that’s all you want you’ll just have to stick with the dolphin fellas. But, Smitten, I think we all know that’s not where you’re at. So embrace the chance to step beyond the standard playbook, and I know your gentleman friend will swim with you into all sorts of wonderful ways to be closer than ever.

Zooey: As for the wetsuit, we’re not familiar with any body suits that offer specially-placed holes for convenient sex with dolphins. I suggest that if your human boyfriend is in his wetsuit, he may be communicating that it’s not a good time for sex, without so many words – even if his body might be straining against those limits and hard as hard gets. That means he feels that special lust for you, and for the beauty of who you are – but that he’s also a responsible man and he’s not going to put you in an awkward spot by letting his lust run rampant over good decisions and wise choices. Remember he’s got pressures and problems up there in the dry flatlands. Even if they’re hard for you to take seriously, they’re real enough for him, and part of loving him is trusting him to balance those pressures just like you balance those in your world on his behalf. Trust me, girl, that when the stars align and it’s all fireworks and warm currents, there won’t be anything between the two of you to keep you from consummating your relationship.

Toggle: Through it all, remember that communication is a two-way street. Listen to his needs in the same way you expect him to listen to yours. Humans often communicate via body language and with other implicit cues, and picking up on that is important. He’s limited and his language doesn’t have the nuance you take for granted. The more you can keep that in mind, the less his limits will trip up what the two of you share. Just think of him not as effectively dis-abled, but instead as fully-able in different and challenging ways. You’ve got all the tools to fill in for where he can’t quite keep up – be generous with your gifts, and he’ll more than make up for it in his passion and true caring for you!

Zooey: We’re so glad to hear you’ve found a cure for the loneliness of show business, Smitten. Be patient with one another, and I’m sure you’ll spend many happy years together. We think you two are close to that big breakthrough, and we sure hope our advice helps ease those final tight squeezes between you and open waters.

Toggle: Treasure what you’ve found together, take the time to let it flower, and those years are yours for the taking. You’re more than smart enough to fill in for his weak spots, and together the two of you are more than each separate – let that strength guide your closeness and it will find a way to develop into everything you’ve dreamed of.

Zooey: Friends, that’s all the time we have this week. Next episode, when the moon is at her fullest, we’ll have more stories from the front lines of cross-species love and we’ll be right here helping smooth out those little rough bits that come from cooking with complex ingredients!

Toggle: But remember, the best dishes come out of a mix of all sorts of different flavors – it takes some creativity, plenty of honesty, and a whole lot of mutual caring. But we see it every episode: the result is passion and love that’s unmatched in this hard world we call home. Never skimp on the love, dear friends, never settle for half-baked when the full meal is right there to be celebrated.

Zooey: We’ll help you get there, while you help us share your real-life stories with everyone out there walking the path of true love.

Toggle: We’ll see you next time, same zoo time, same zoo channel!


6. Outro

Fausty: Thanks, friends, for listening to Zooier Than Thou.

Toggle: You can subscribe to the podcast via our RSS feed: just point your favourite podcast client at and off you go.

Fausty: Our podcast’s website is, yep, Twitter @ZooierThanThou, and you can follow Zooey’s knotty advice @AskZooey.

Toggle: A reminder that we have a form that enables anonymous submissions to the podcast on our website,! You can ask Zooey the best way to woo a goat, tell Fausty his voice sucks, or send us ASCII art of a horse’s butt!

Fausty: You can contact co-host Fausty through his website,, or by looking in the mirror and repeating three times, “Fausty, Fausty, Fausty.” It works! Try it!

Toggle: Zooier Than Thou isn’t trademarked and you can share it with anyone you want – think PS4, not XBOX One.

Fausty: All nonhumans who helped make this podcast happen definitely had the consent of their human partners. We got those consent formed signed in triplicate.

Toggle: Rottweiler studs tend to have incredibly long ties, up to an hour! Plan accordingly.

Fausty: Be nice to each other. It’s the sexiest, zooiest thing you can do.

Toggle: Stay Defiant, fellow zoos!

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